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I already posted this in the budgie chat area but have not gotten any responses, so I figured I would try here. I have put together a dark factor violet female American budgie and a dark factor violet male budgie. I am trying to get an all black budgie. They have had one clutch of 2 eggs that have hatched so far. Both babies turned out to be dark factor violets. Has anyone had any experience/success trying to breed budgies to get an all black budgie? I am trying to come up with a new color of budgie but also make sure they are fully healthy and not inbred in anyway. Any suggestions?

double dark factor blues or violets would result in "mauve", which is a dark muddy color.
dark factor greens are very dark green.
I'm not certain what would happen with greys, but black & whites have happened with masked lovebirds.

If "black" parakeets were possible, it would have already happened.

I've seen pictures of 'anthracite' budgies, but never in person. I would assume that it may help to breed dark grey budgies, but then I would assume that they would be a lot more common. It seems to me that the anthracite is rather a separate mutation from the greys and violets. I'm curious though, do you have any pictures of your violet budgies?

Budgies color variations
(Photos courtesy of Mr. Hans-Jürgen H. Lenk)

These dark, almost black birds are not the result of the common grey gene, but it is the Anthracite gene that causes their feathers to darken into that stunning shade of grey.

Budgie Colors & Mutations
Anthracite

The anthracite budgie has a black (or very, very dark grey) body color. All other markings on the budgie are normal, except for the cheek patches, which are the same black as the body color. This variety is very new and was first established in Germany. This variety has been shown to be genetically semi-dominant. A single anthracite factor produces a darkening effect extremely similar to a single dark factor (producing cobalt). A budgie that is double-factor anthracite appears as the true anthracite with the black body color.

photo courtesy of Budgerigar World magazine

More on Anthracites
http://translate.google.com/translate?h ... kel24.html

Anthracite chick
http://www.vogelzucht-kaiser.de/images/ ... 7_-048.jpg
http://www.vogelzucht-kaiser.de/images/ ... 7_-046.jpg
http://www.vogelzucht-kaiser.de/images/ ... 7_-047.jpg


Blackface

Black face is a new mutation in which the black stripes (undulations) of the head extend all the way into the face and mask, as well as the body feathers. The blackface mutation also causes a darkening of the body color. This mutation is extremely rare and last known to only exist in the Netherlands.

photos courtesy of and copyright Didier Mervilde

More on blackface
http://www.euronet.nl/users/hnl/blackfa.htm

ABirdShop98 wrote:I already posted this in the budgie chat area but have not gotten any responses, so I figured I would try here. I have put together a dark factor violet female American budgie and a dark factor violet male budgie. I am trying to get an all black budgie. They have had one clutch of 2 eggs that have hatched so far. Both babies turned out to be dark factor violets. Has anyone had any experience/success trying to breed budgies to get an all black budgie? I am trying to come up with a new color of budgie but also make sure they are fully healthy and not inbred in anyway. Any suggestions?

I did respond on the other board.

If you are talking about Anthracites, that mutation came out in the English budgie in Germany. The photo of that bird has been posted here. I know of only one person who has imported these birds from Germany to the U.S. They are in AZ. YOu could buy splits for about $1,000, but they look nothing like the photo of the visual. This mutation breeds recessive.

You might want to go to the Budgerigar Association of America's web site and read the article on Violets by Mike Rankin.
http://www.budgerigarassociation.com

Believe me, just coming up with a new color just does not happen on command, ask every serious budgie breeder who has been breeding birds for decades. New mutations pop up in the least expected places and usually by someone not trying to create one.

I did respond on the other board.

If you are talking about Anthracites, that mutation came out in the English budgie in Germany. The photo of that bird has been posted here. I know of only one person who has imported these birds from Germany to the U.S. They are in AZ. YOu could buy splits for about $1,000, but they look nothing like the photo of the visual. This mutation breeds recessive.

You might want to go to the Budgerigar Association of America's web site and read the article on Violets by Mike Rankin.
http://www.budgerigarassociation.com

Believe me, just coming up with a new color just does not happen on command, ask every serious budgie breeder who has been breeding birds for decades. New mutations pop up in the least expected places and usually by someone not trying to create one.

Yes, I know it just does not happen on demand. It is just something I am attempting. If it happens, it happens. I love all of them anyway. I was just curious. I will continue to try different combos to see what I can come up with. I think it is alot of fun just seeing what you get, whether it is what you are trying for or not.

ABirdShop98 wrote:Yes, I know it just does not happen on demand. It is just something I am attempting. If it happens, it happens. I love all of them anyway. I was just curious. I will continue to try different combos to see what I can come up with. I think it is a lot of fun just seeing what you get, whether it is what you are trying for or not.

If this is your goal then you need to work with English budgies not the Americans. American budgies are bred willy nilly. They have every color an mutation and maybe even the kitchen sink tossed into their background - which is fine for pet birds. If you are truly trying to come up with something new and KNOW where it was derived from, you need to work with English budgies/exhibition budgies.

English budgies bred for exhibition have color standards they must follow. You don't go putting spangles with pieds, cinnamons with lace-wings, etc,. Well....if you do that one odd time to try and get a difficult hen to go to nest those chicks don't stay in your breeding program, they get out sourced into the pet market. English budgie breeders are dedicated to keeping pedigree records on their birds. These pedigrees show all the colors and mutations in each bird's family history. This is highly valuable information if you are seriously working to create a new color or mutation.

I can see this as a win, win, win situation for you going this last route. Getting into the English hobby, as a side line to your breeding program you might also discover the fun of exhibiting your birds. Selling your excess stock can pay their upkeep and if you start doing very well on the show bench it can become quite profitable. These birds are in high demand. English budgies can NOT be colony bred like the American budgies so bird mills don't attempt. Everything about the English is a recessive trait starting with the most noticeable thing - their size. Individual cage breeding is necessary, which is something you would already be doing to come up with your new colors and mutations.

If you would like help getting started with English send me a private message. I will be able to help you find breeders to get you started.

Kerry

I have a mauve American male (cobalt, double dark factor)/split opaline bred back to his daughter (cobalt, opaline). Ordinarily, I would not have set up this pairing, but these were the first 2 birds (of my 8 pairs) that were interested in nesting in August when I start setting up my pairs to produce some babies for Christmas. (The birds that do not nest by October won't start nesting till January.) Apparently, the male is also split to grey, as one of the babies is a double dark factor grey opaline. It's gorgeous, as the opaline character widens and darkens the black bands in the barring on the wing, and also adds and intensifies the grey ground color on the shoulder .
I picked up this male at the pet shop 3 years ago, from a batch of breeder birds which someone had given up, as they were quite undersized, and probably inbred. There might have been some English budgie and some serious breeding program in the background, as the birds had nice conformation and perfect dots on their necklaces. This clutch of babies are easily twice the size of their father. Sorry, I won't be able to post a picture, as I am deficient in both know-how and equipment.

Apologies for my previous excitement. The new baby is not a dark grey, as the feathers keep growing,
but it is still a medium to dark silver, and very attractive, but I am sure that this is not new.
I am not sure about the effects of a double dark factor as it
is related to the grey color, and I am not sure about which layer of color it affects. There are 3 separate layers of color:
yellow, blue, and black.